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MOTM 8.07
| deadline to enter maps: 2007, 08, 14 (Year, month, day) |
| You know the drill. |
Comments:
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Pompompooooooooom O,o |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Gogo Coastal Battery, WIN TIHS MOTM!1!! |
| ptar |
| Should i add eres a second time? ^^ Maybe it'll win. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Nonono!! :D |
| ptar |
| :) |
| Nightmarjoo |
| I dunno what it is but there's something I don't like about Battle Marshes, idk something awkward about the size and proportion of things I think. |
| Crackling |
| should i add iron flush? maybe its gonna win again |
| Crackling |
| submitted Winding Road, its not even a map of mine :P but its the really BEST map i have seen so far on broodwarmaps.net, dont think theres anything what might be even half that good oO its so gosu... i felt in love :O |
| ptar |
| 3 things i don't like submitting winding road: 1. It's an korean map, ofc it can be added, but i think the mapper isn't active (maybe i'm wrong) 2. It was a motm(or something like this) on intothemap.com 3. It's the biggest rival to my maps^^ Ofc it's a great map and i like to play it, but i don't think it should get MOTM here. |
| Crackling |
| ou so its not by herb? i thought he made it :D kk than not :P dumb map :X |
| ptar |
| ofc Herb made this map.^^ Lil disacord :) |
| Crackling |
| btw soon new testbug+crackling map coming and conquer everything KEKEKEK ^___^ |
| ptar |
| testbug+crackling = dreamteam! |
| Testbug |
| Testbug+Crackling xD (he loves me too much :o) oh Elysium Fields, Elysium Fields, Elysium Fields!!! where is Elysium Fields? |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Where it belongs, not here :( |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Elysium Fields not updated yet. ^^ |
| Crackling |
| testbug+crackling=hardcoresex -> babymap+time > gosumap :> modified by Crackling |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| I gonna rule the world from my Coastal Battery ;-] modified by ProTosS4EveR |
| LML |
| "3 things i don't like submitting winding road: 1. It's an korean map, ofc it can be added, but i think the mapper isn't active (maybe i'm wrong) 2. It was a motm(or something like this) on intothemap.com 3. It's the biggest rival to my maps^^ Ofc it's a great map and i like to play it, but i don't think it should get MOTM here." actually its not that good map. there is only the middle, to have big fights. and on those small cliff parts, u can even place all your units, too well. |
| Crackling |
| lol LML^^ "actually its not that good map. there is only the middle, to have big fights. and on those small cliff parts, u can even place all your units, too well." :D:D:D would be fun if u would have been joking but u arent. so its sad :( maybe when u get more expirience with mapmaking and begin to make sth. what could be even _called_ a map u will understand that its a great map -.- ou, with your mapping skills u could be a mapper of blizzard :D PS: ye, i didnt knew its korean, remove it. but its still an amazing map :) |
| ptar |
| I think LML is talking as a gamer not as a mapper, crackling ;) modified by ptar |
| Testbug |
| ??? you meant testbug the guy who only makes 3 players map? modified by Testbug |
| ptar |
| Ohh, sry ^^' i meant crackling :) |
| Crackling |
| i was also talking as a gamer :) LML whats your favourite map? why? explain pzl why u like it! *prepair to start laughing* :> |
| Testbug |
| os there a really natural start location on (2)Triad?? :o |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Starting locations are overrated. |
| LML |
| My favortie map atm, is TauCross. I like it, because it has big fields, but not too big, ofc, its a bit inbalanced, since the place at 3 is the biggest, imo. Also I like it, because I mostly play great games on it, which are fun to play (which u cant say about all maps, that u have fun, while playing on them!). |
| Nightmarjoo |
| It's a protoss map, of course you like it. |
| LML |
| yeah, but I once, also had other favorite maps. Such as longinus, Nemesis, RoV, RushHour3....... and u cant tell me, that all those maps r protoss maps ;) |
| flothefreak |
| i think taucross is (despite its heavy pos. imbaness) a very solid map with - what is almost perfect executed on it - a great flow and expo placement. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| not for zerg :( |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Longinus is p=t and p>z, p map :) Nemesis I dunno at all, but I'd guess it's a p map with its expo layout and openness. Rov is weird, but I think its linear layout is p>z. rh3 makes contain hard, and is tight in the key locations, I'd say p>z but I think statistically it's the other way around. |
| flothefreak |
| actually, it is P>all, independant of the map. just compare the first fighting units of each race! zealot>ling,rine in HP and damage OMG imba :< |
| Crackling |
| LOL IMBA ZEALOT LOOOOL i stop playing sc fuck blizzard making imba game lol ...lol lol |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Zealot = 100 minerals, 2 pop. Marine = 50 minerals, 1 pop. 2 Zergling = 50 minerals, 1 pop. For 100 minerals and 2 pops you have : 1 Zealot = 2 Marines = 4 Zerglings. 1 Zealot : 100 hp, 60 shield, 8*2 damage. 2 Marines : 2*40 hp, 6*2 damage. OMG SUX :< 4 Zerglings : 4*35 hp, 5*4 damage. OMG IMBA :< 4 Zerglings > 1 zealot. 1 Zealot > 2 Marines. 4 Zerglings > 2 Marines. OMG ZERGLING IMBAAA!!1! :< modified by ProTosS4EveR |
| Crackling |
| 1 Zealot > 2 Marines. rumour. |
| flothefreak |
| DT > marine, zergling. you see there is no chance. |
| Crackling |
| hm there was a thread on tl.net whats the best 1v1 unit :D:D DA > all (except obs) DA can MC each unit, if this unit is organic and cloaked (DT) he can maelstorm it and mc after. a wraith will run out of energie (cloaked) before killing the DA > mc the obs cant be maelstorm, so no mc, but obs also doesnt have attack so its a draw >.< |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| 1 Zealot > 2 Marines with no micro... |
| flothefreak |
| burrowed zerg units are a draw as well |
| Testbug |
| motm8? this conversation is stupid, but let's be some stupid for a sec: science vessel can irradiate burrowed zerg units psionic storm can kill burrowed zerg units. nuke can kill burrowed zerg units what about placing spider mines near the zerg burrowed unit? will it work? haven't tested yet |
| flothefreak |
| it works i was only talking about DA>all except obs. this aint true as zerg units can just burrow and be safe against DA in 1on1 =) |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Can still mc burrowed units. Also can still maelstorm burrowed units. |
| Crackling |
| maelstorm (now they are visible) and now mc GG |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Kakaru > all GG NO RE YOU CAN STOP STARCRAFT TY. |
| Crackling |
| merge 4 twilight archn to get the UBERARCHON1!!!! its instant attack is the black hole, its spells are: maphack, moneyhack, dischack and optical flare (u know its VERY strong kk) gg |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Crackling there is no doubt that kakaru > all . :( |
| Nightmarjoo |
Uberarchon wins by dividing by zero. |
| LML |
| "Can still mc burrowed units. Also can still maelstorm burrowed units." nope, u cant maelstorm burrowed units. You can only maelstorm them, while they r burrowing ;) |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Shit, i know why there are so many black holes near me... :( |
| Lancet |
| Maybe they are anuses! : ^ ) |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| No votes?? :( Must the MOTM7 finish to start votes of MOTM8? |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| I don't want to vote first! >_< |
| Crackling |
| some1 remove crap maps and winding roads plz >.< |
| LML |
| yeah, 2times winding roads o.O |
| Excalibur |
| #1 Coastal Battery Ive been watching this map and its gotten a lot better since it was first uploaded. Its beutiful, i love the concept and layout. #2 Endless Fields Despite its blocky-ness, its extended attempts make it a risky map, the layout is nice and it seems that with some adjustment it could be an amazing map. |
| flothefreak |
| no, endless fields no way imo |
| Excalibur |
| In that case Flo i wish i could give all 3 of my votes to Coastal. :P |
| Testbug |
| my vote was for Clementine, where is it? ok then my vote goes for may own map |
| Excalibur |
| Endless needs a blocky-ectomy before it wins anything. :P |
| Testbug |
| what does "blocky-ectomy" means? :( |
| Nightmarjoo |
| I removed Clementine, it's a bad map, I don't want to redo it from start, but I should if I want it to be good. I was gonna make a 1.1 edit, but saw that its positional balance is too fucked. I'm not redoing it, it's not a good enough map for that effort. Of course anyone else can edit it if they want. But really any edit would have to be from scratch, which sucks lol. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Battlemarhes: I just think the sls are too far from the nat, perhaps move the sl and redo the formations to be more like longinus, with space behind the sl and in front and whatnot? If you did that I'd almost reccomend placing the sl with its back to the middle of the map. I don't like how your main can be tanked from the mineral only, but that might just be me. Seems hard for zerg to take their 3rd gas, I dunno. Maybe move the mineral only up, and move the gas expo to the edge of the map, using the terrain near the water. Then you could alter that expo a bit since it would no longer be directly in the line of movement. Coastal Battery: The main space looks lacking, how about clearing out that stupid corner? I think the middle min onlys are too far from the nat, perhaps move them to below the jutted out part of the temple. The third gas looks hard to defend for zvt, but I'm worried that tightening the choke could mess things up in pvt. But the middle gas on the east side looks too tight and crowded. It's just kinda awkwardly thrown there. Perhaps ruin your coast and move it to the right, making the walls less steep of a curve, and making it not in the way of pathing. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Winding road seems like a terran paradise. Eres: GAS ISSUE. The corner base looks impossible for zerg to support. mm I'm having trouble determining how balance will play out on this map. Needs testing asap. I'm willing to play if someone is playing at a time I'm awake :) Myxomatosis seems alright balanced. I'm concerned it might be p>t because a 3rd gas looks hard to secure, but I could be wrong, I'm no t or p player lol. Seems like p map overall, but not bad, probably will play well. Morris Plains is funny. I think it's actually p=t and p>z lol. Its expo layout is similar to tau's, which seems to play fairly p>z. The one thing I really don't like is that there is no where on the entire map to play overlords. That really huts zerg in zvt. LML's maps are probably fine balance wise, since no one will play them because they are so awkward. lol sorry LML. They're not bad, but I think you definitely need work as a mapper. I can go into the specifics of awkwardness later, I don't think these maps are up to motm quality at the moment. Judging balance on Lancet's maps is impossible for me. They are too weird. I have no experience to judge by. Triad would need heavy testing lol. Scrimmage is a neat map, but I don't think it's up to motm quality, since it's not very solid imo. Basicly it's a map that I can mention in the newspost as a neat thing to try :) "Micro map of the month" :D |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Amnesiac is interesting, but looks really hard on terran vs protoss. Metropolis: The middle is a bit too random for my tastes. The mains seem kinda awkward. The map is really open, especially for having gasless nats. I don't care for the concept of defending the map's gas at one point, and the positional balance of the way you guard the cliff/lowground expos looks questionable. Endless Fields looks really interesting, but I don't like its positional balance. The sizes and distances are all off =/ Would be impossible to make it perfect without redoing the map, which looks to be one son of a bitch to do lol. Concept is nice, execution imo isn't as nice. (3)Maps are harder than the enamel of my teeth after today's dentist appointment to make. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Coastal Battery vs Endless Fields... |
| Nightmarjoo |
| I would have voted Myxomatosis first, but it has no chance at winning motm (no one ever votes for Saurus' maps because he doesn't put huge detail decoration), so I put Morris Plains as first. But I'll withold my vote from it if Nasty doesn't fix the issue that zerg cannot place their ovys anywhere in zvt. Scrimmage 3rd haha. The other maps have imo flaws which hurt the map too much, or just need testing which they never will recieve. |
| flothefreak |
| this is EXACTLY what i was talking about when telling you not to desperately search "flaws" (lol, what expression for no cool ovi places) in others' maps. just place lings to the places you want to scout?! |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Flothefreak do you play starcraft? lol. When you're zerg, you scout with your ovy right? Then you find a place to sit your ovy where it can't be shot but it can watch enemy troop movement. You don't have 6 zerglings you can disperse to various places of the map at all times in the game, because you need them. Also, it is rather time consuming to keep watching your lings and moving them from being killed. Letting them die is a waste, and every ling counts. Ovys move on their own away from being shot, and they have a lot of hp, and depending on where they are they might not even be shot. What I'm saying comes from playing starcraft lol. First thing any zeg player will want to know is where the fuck do I put my overlords. If there's no place, then I have to do what, pick a place in my main and mass them there to get raped? Of course I can throw a spore down, which likely is a waste of a drone, which can make a huge difference in the game. "just place lings to the places you want to scout" I lol'd. This is why I haven't been commenting much lately, you guys don't really think about how maps are played, just think of funny timed scenarios involving invincible terrans. |
| flothefreak |
| and no you cry because you can't place your overlords invisibly, thus making the map imba? guess what, protoss and terran have no overlords. observers will get hunted as ovis get and terran doesnt have infinite scan. besides, terrans can afford vultures/marines denying expos and scout, and protoss can do the same with zeals. so zerg cant spend 150 minerals in midgame for this?! i dont want to start another struggle, so i conclude just with the fact that this is NOTHING you could blame as a real flaw of the map. it could be better, but it isnt an issue. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Ok, to avoid an argument I won't explain my side. To put it shortly, your argument shows a lack of understanding of zerg. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Fuck Coastal Battery will lose vs Endless Fields. My map has just some deco whereas testbug's map decoration is godly. :( |
| Excalibur |
| Testbug's deco is extremely ugly and blocky on both the reverse stairs and the edges of his buildible temple tops. Costal for the win. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Deco is godly from the picture, i know that in the map the stairs a very ugly... |
| ScoutWBF |
| "Deco is godly from the picture"...wait what? pictule is no important! you see ingame keke? |
| Nightmarjoo |
| lol decoration should be illegal, so you vote for the better map, not the better decorated map. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Not everybody will try the map and look how is the map ingame. |
| Lancet |
| What is the point of making the most beautiful map in the world spending a week decorating it if the concept essentially has been done before a thousand times? Also, whatever happened to spells on maps? Nobody does those anymore? |
| Excalibur |
| Its not purely the deco, im saying deco because thats the look of the map and if he would simply see that the blend i gave him incorperates perfectly into what hes trying to do he could make the map look much better. Im also nearly done with a better reverse stair ramp. |
| Crackling |
| testbug didnt had time to modify endless fields he will du it on thursday! |
| Testbug |
| i won't use Excalibur transitions. thatt's all |
| ptar |
| But why? I think he executed it good, better then you. Your temple looks so cutted. You should use his transition, or maybe edit your one. |
| Excalibur |
| I respect that TestBug doesnt want to use them, and in that case, not because its my blend hes not using, but rather that his maps blocky, hes not getting my vote. |
| Testbug |
| my map is too tight and excalibur's uses the normal temple borders (use space) and looks rectangular. sorry but i find excalibur's cutted and not mine, maybe because i did it :( look Excalibut, i tried to use yours but i can't do the same thing at south part of temple, can you please finish a complete block? modified by Testbug |
| Nightmarjoo |
| I'll quote myself, "Coastal Battery: The main space looks lacking, how about clearing out that stupid corner? I think the middle min onlys are too far from the nat, perhaps move them to below the jutted out part of the temple. The third gas looks hard to defend for zvt, but I'm worried that tightening the choke could mess things up in pvt. But the middle gas on the east side looks too tight and crowded. It's just kinda awkwardly thrown there. Perhaps ruin your coast and move it to the right, making the walls less steep of a curve, and making it not in the way of pathing" |
| Testbug |
| where are the fake voters? i only need 7 of you!!! |
| Nightmarjoo |
| lol I'll make some fake names if you want. |
| Testbug |
| YES PLEASEEEE i only need 7 more points 2 win 3rd motm ^^ |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Somebody don't know for which map he has to vote. coastal or endless? :o |
| Testbug |
| oh nightmarjoo, now i need 17 fake votes to win T_T |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Should I remove Coastal Battery? This motm will be just like the last one, a map will get by far the most votes, and the author won't ever edit and improve the map, and the comp will sit for a while, because I won't post the map lol. |
| Professor~Oak |
| Hmm Endless fields is such a nice map with a great concept of a double gas main and gasless nat. Even if it's tight I think its gameplay will be very interesting. |
| Pacman |
| Endless fields is a decent map, but I really don't like that 4 o clock starting location is so much closer to the natural expo. Also, the expo at 10's top ramp should be moved to the right so that pathing doesn't go through the expo (into the miners or the command center, etc). The natural expo at 4 has no room behind its minerals, but the other natural expansions do. Since you obviously can't add terrain to the expansion at 10, you should take away from the terrain at the other two expos, at 5 and 2 o clock, which are clearly much more roomy. .......................(>') Pacman |
| Electric-Spider |
| I hope all those doodads appear in Endless Fields, otherwise there will be quite a few tank spots, and in random places. If they don't all appear, then you should pick areas where you wouldn't mind having tank drops and clear the doodads in that place and its symmetrical copy elsewhere on the map for positional balance. The expansion at 2 doesn't have as much room behind its minerals as does the other two expos with gas. 10 block main and 7 block nat seems pretty high money, wandering looks like it might be bad too. Reavers will have a ball at the mains, so easy to hit a group of miners because of how the minerals are arranged. Racially the map might be fine, there's a lot of minerals on the map compared to gas, which should make the the tightness of the map hurt balance less. Myxomatosis is a funny map, but Morris Plains is better, should play smoothly. |
| Chaucer |
| In Endless Fields, can't you just place raised jungle with tiles to make small blobs to fill in the tank holes rather than spamming doodads? Also, seems to me that you can take both the mineral only expo and the expansion with gas at the same time and defend that one spot and turtle a bit. Taking new bases is pretty easy then, so the map encourages macro/turtling. Perhaps reduce the amount of blocks at the expos to make them less worth turtling for, or recuding their mineral values significantly to make them last longer, and therefore encouraging agressive expoing rather than turtling. Or both taking away blocks and reducing the value of the blocks :) Morris Plains looks questionable balance wise, with the expansions with gas all being vulnerable, but that might not hurt balance and it might just have a fun gameplay. It will probably play similarly to tau cross, except without the pylon wall cheese^^ Garden in the looks nice, but it's hard to tell with such a small picture. |
| Crimson)S(hadow |
| endless fields ftw.... i dont really like the middle in shield... it seems clostraphobic...and the map pretty wide.... i like endless fields cuz u get to roam around cuz lots of pathways... but shield bat is is like... u turn right... then go down... thats it lol... and plus i can't do my quadriple expo opening there =( |
| Nightmarjoo |
| lol |
| ptar |
| There you got your fake votes testbug. :) |
| Crimson)S(hadow |
| flo vote already so we can see if u were sarcastic or not about when u said "deco is awsome, from raisedjungle/tree setup to dirt/ruins setup to the godly templewall-ruins which is executed so perfectly, you should actually get a price for this. i bet this map will rough up both, mappers and gamers. it will get a lot of echo, as you used a quite basic but working concept with some innovation and guised it with prefect look and terrain. i cant say more than "you just managed to create a map which is as close to the ONE PERFECT MAP we all try to execute as one has ever been." even korean mappers and league players will go crazy." |
| Crimson)S(hadow |
| what does coastal batt have on the tiki torches and the deco? |
| flothefreak |
| well that was before i looked at the ramps closely :D it may be overreacted, but still it is a very cool map. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| rofl no one cares about fake votes? wtf haha oh well, it's only losing by 4 if you remove the fake votes, and I could switch my vote to it and put if ahead by 1 so whatever ;D |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| Give fake votes to Myxomatosis too! :d |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Why? lol |
| Lancet |
| Endless fields seems like a decent map and I normally put the map concept over the map beauty factor, but those ramps are just too ugly for my taste, a real eyesore. All ramps that have internal extructure like steps look awful when you try to reverse then. I have tried to find the right tiles but after a while I gave up. |
| Testbug |
will something like this solve the problems? modified by Testbug |
| Alumni |
| you guys shouldn't count them as fake votes but rather more like the opinions of the gamers because shouldn't they have a say if we're making maps for them to play? without gamers we are fcuked. |
| flothefreak |
| fakevotes are made from one person with several accounts to push their maps. |
| Crackling |
| badass testbug :< |
| Nightmarjoo |
| lol alumni Testbug, how can I know if the map is better if I can't see it? That's smallest pic ever. |
| ProTosS4EveR |
| I already saw a smaller picture. :P I think the pic was 2cm * 2cm xD |
| Nightmarjoo |
| lol |
| Testbug |
modified by Testbug |
| Lancet |
| Come on, post the winners, Endless Fields, Coastal Batery and Morris Plains. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Awaiting edits for Endless Fields, Coastal Battery, and imo slight edits could improve Morris Plains, but Nasty never listens to me because he pretends he is a korean mapper (and ergo cares nothing about gameplay or balance). |
| Testbug |
| i can make end field edits today(just copy pasting the terrains, it's all about decoration) but coastal battery needs A LOT of work. and morris plains needs ovie spots or what? |
| Nightmarjoo |
| The ovie spot is the thing I'm talking about on Morris Plains, yeah. |
| Lancet |
| "Nasty never listens to me because he pretends he is a korean mapper (and ergo cares nothing about gameplay or balance)." And they are the ones whose maps get played in the big leagues. Don't you think it is time we learned something from the Korean mappers? Testbug, now it looks much better, great map, I gave you my vote. Lancet modified by Lancet |
| flothefreak |
| we can learn their deco skill. but not their approach to balance. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Lancet, you're actually incorrect. From my understanding of how it works, and I got this from Nasty, who got this from Mapghost, basicly only the mappers who got lucky in the beginning (Valkyrie, Forgotten_, etc) of progaming decide what maps get into the proleague, and that there is almost no chance of even an amazing map from a korean amateur on a well known mapping team with amazing balance, concept, gameplay, etc, to even get into the proleague. Unless they suck off Rose.Of.Dream or something, lol. Just waiting for motm7 to be ready to post this one. |
| Nightmarjoo |
| Eh I think the map still has some little issues, but whatever, it's probably not going to get any better. |
| Testbug |
| "Just waiting for motm7 to be ready to post this one." just post motm8, motm9 and motm10... ppl will forget this1 ;) haven't this happened already? :S |
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